Miracles Begin With the Right Question

How "miracle producing" are the questions you ask? Questions are one of the most overlooked tools of communication. They have the ability to shift perspective, change an outcome, release stress and anxiety. Join Amy Steindler and me as we unpack the power of questions and how we can unleash miracles with the right question asked at the right time. 

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Transcript

Adina Tovell  
Hi, this is Adina here with today's episode of courage to be curious with Adina Tovell and today of course with Amy Steindler as well. So courage to be curious with Adina and Amy. Hey, Amy. Hi there, good to see you. And we are so excited because the month of September is going to be about the power of questions. Amy and I asked questions for a living, we ask questions of ourselves all the time. We read about questions, we write about questions, we think about questions, and we want you to as well. So we are dedicating an entire month to thinking about the power of questions. And since this is the first episode in the month, we also want to preview what is coming. Now. I have mentioned this on a previous podcast, this book, ask powerful questions create conversations that matter to authors will wise and Chad Littlefield. And we are so fortunate because they are bringing their incredible wisdom, sense of humor and fantastic energy to the podcast. So the lead episode we will be talking with will and in our grand finale episode, we'll be talking with Chad. And we are just going to have a tremendous amount of fun. I think, Amy this month talking about questions.

So Amy, let's start off. And I think it's good for us to just think about why questions like why do we find questions so powerful that you and I basically run businesses off of asking questions. So, you know, let let's just jam on this for a little bit. For you, when when you think about questions, and the use of questions in your life and in your work, what comes to mind for you?

Amy Steindler  
There's something so compelling about a well ask question, you know, and just the, the and I don't want to use the word right, but I'm gonna use it anyway, you know, the right question at the right time. Like, just just finding that question that that resonates. Let's call it the resonant question, right. Love that. So, and for me and for my clients. And I wonder I imagine it's true for you, too. It's about connection. That's that's a moment of like, true connection, like someone is stopped in their tracks by the question is like, Wow, that is the question I need to answer for myself right now. I think there's just something so compelling about being able to connect with someone on a level that just stops them in their tracks.

Adina Tovell  
And I like that word. I've got to start taking that on the resonant question. Because what that word really means like when something resonates, we actually can feel it right. We can feel something happening inside when it resonates. You know, sometimes we hear somebody talk about something and say, Wow, that really resonates which actually means that we started to have some kind of response inside that's moving and shifting us. And as you talked about asking the resonant question, the right one and the right moment, and what that can do to bring connection to stimulate discernment. I also really like to talk about that the same happens inside myself, right? When I go to ask myself a question and I talk about the fact that I often journal. My journal entries often begin with a question not surprising, right? But my journal entry question. And my journal entries often begin with a question. And then I'll see where it takes me and then suddenly, more questions will arise. And they almost become like the current that is pulling me along, to discover and reveal something that needs to come to the surface.

Amy Steindler  
I love that metaphor, current surface water, right? The idea that this is part of your your flow, it's part of your process, part of the flow of your life. I love that.

Adina Tovell  
I have found that, you know, in this like in my life right now, this is one of the periods where there's a lot of things kind of popping up in my life, right? The unexpected things that arise in our life often give us The most create the most amount of discomfort or, you know, we kind of get a little jittery and nervous or uncomfortable with the uncertainty or the transitions. And I always find that that's a particularly poignant time to start asking questions, because my alternative is, is getting engulfed by the anxiety or the stress, right, I have two options. And, you know, for a long time, I remember just getting kind of consumed and swallowed into, you know, the swirling siphon of just anxiety while something was going on that I didn't have control over. And what I found recently is that, as you said, the question stops you in your tracks? Well, if I want to stop the swirling, asking a question about where I am, what up what you know, possible responses I can have, what are the ways I can see it really helps to just stop all that swirling and bring me to a new place?

Amy Steindler  
So let's add to the connection piece that a resonant question also pulls us into the present moment. And it gives us that meta awareness and takes us out, as you said, out of the swirl, and gives us a perspective on it, right, an observer perspective. So I'm going to add mindfulness and present moment awareness to that.

Adina Tovell  
Which is beautiful, because we just finished a whole month of talking about perspective. And so questions as having this incredible power of bringing us are in it positioning us to have a new perspective on something?

Amy Steindler  
Absolutely. You know, and I think that, you know, at some point, we need to address the the non resonant questions and where they come from, and what happens when someone puts one of those out there. You know, and as a coach, you know, that happens to me, sometimes I'll ask a question that just doesn't resonate. And, you know, what do you do with that?

Adina Tovell  
I, which I love, right? Because even as a coach, it's not like, we've got the secret Bible of questions. And like, oh, here's the one for this moment. And you pull that out, and you're going to hit the bull's eye every time. Because some questions. And what I love about it is that if I throw out a bunch of questions, especially with someone else, that aren't very resonant, where I don't see that kind of shift or curiosity start to happen. I know that good. That's that's information. It's not that it's not that like, this isn't the right path. This isn't the right thing, I get to start to eliminate pads or ways of thinking that are not the resonant one, which is as useful as you know, the other one, because it's getting us closer to finding it. And it's not about this, I never feel badly, like if I you know, pitch one over the net, and nothing happens. I'm like, oh, okay, great. Let me pitch another one and see what happens. So there's this piece of like, and then you know, it when you hit the right one, when you find that resonant one, because there's an entire, like, shift, right, and body and energy and facial expression.

Amy Steindler  
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I think for me, when I went to Ghana, it's like, you're listening to this beautiful Symphony, and all of a sudden, it was for a wedding, somebody hits the wrong key, you know, and it just sticks out and it just doesn't work. And you know, it's okay. And it's okay to have a sense of humor about it. And so I think, you know, for our listeners, if you're thinking about, you know, how do I become better at asking questions that being curious, developing my curiosity. And, you know, for those who maybe haven't heard, you know, some of the previous podcasts, you know, I talked about how I was not delivered into this world with a wellspring of curiosity. I mean, I was a tiny person, we all are, at some point, you know, I lost all of that. And so I am still developing that skill of staying with the curiosity. So you know, we don't want to let those moments discourage us from continuing to find other questions. So I just want to throw that out there for anyone who's listening that maybe a little bit gun shy around, you know, is it okay for me to ask deep questions?

Adina Tovell  
to things that what you were just talking about made me think of is one is a resource question. Right. So this book on Ask powerful questions that we're going to be hearing more about this month, definitely talks about how to construct and put together powerful questions. So I love that. I also really love Warren burgers work. He wrote a book called a more beautiful question, which I love and Amy, it looks like pulling it off her shelf. So if you're watching the video, she's got it right there. If I were in my office, I'd be pulling down my copy too. And then he also has a second follow up book that is called a book of more beautiful questions, where he has an entire book, and then Amy, there's this resource that we're going to get into In a moment, which is from courage to be curious here and our own set of questions as well, because we've got three decks of 52 questions each, which makes like 156 questions that are all really powerful questions to ask. And so we're going to get in a little bit to working with that. The other thing that you said that I just want to make note of before we do that, because we're gonna have some fun is, how do you know if it's okay to ask the question? Right. And that, to me is like the title of this courage to be curious, right, the Curiosity part, but there is some courage in it, because we recognize that asking a resonant question. Like, it feels almost intimate, right? Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. And there's the sense of, do we have permission to enter an intimate space with someone? And here's, I think, Amy, I would love to hear your response here, too. But here's my response to it is, I think one of our deepest desires as humans is to be seen and to be known. Right? Like we want to be understood. I don't know that I've ever met somebody who says, Oh, I love going to parties and having all that surface level conversation, right? No. Loves? I mean, some people are better at it than others. But who actually loves that? You know, most often I hear people say, you know, I went, I had fun. But you know, I don't know, like, how do you really have conversations, or they don't like going to parties, because they feel like there isn't anything meaningful happening. Or they're sitting at home with their family, feeling like we're just going through the motions and watching TV and eating dinner, eating dinner, but I don't feel like we're really connecting. And I would want to say what if we trusted, that most people would like to be seen and known and heard and understood, rather than assuming that they didn't.

Amy Steindler  
I loved that I loved that assumption of sort of positive intent, which I'm sure we'll talk about again. And there's, there's an element of trust here that has to be established. Right? I think you touched on in a moment ago, it's okay to ask permission. Can I ask you something that I've been curious about for a while? And it's not a kind of a surfacey? Question. You know, so asking permission is perfectly okay. And I think the trust piece comes from intention. And, you know, I've been reading and maybe it was an ask powerful questions, I can't remember, I'm reading like four books, I can't remember which one it was. But the idea of stating your intention first, to give context to let people know, hey, you know, I've been thinking about you and about our relationship. And, you know, I really want to deepen that it's important to me or our friendship, could I ask you a question about that?

Adina Tovell  
It's interesting that you said that. So I was recently talking with somebody who is starting to date, and you know, wanting to have first date and talking about how very often first dates are. So surface level, right? We asked about this, and what do you do for work? And you know, where do you like, and we ask these things, but then at the end don't necessarily know at the end whether or not you really like the person or you don't like the person like you don't really have a sense of anything except whether the, and then if there's pauses in the conversation, it feels awkward, because like, okay, someone's got to shoot another question out there just to kind of keep things rolling. But there isn't a knowing that can happen. There isn't like a connection that feels genuine happening. And so we were talking about these different levels, like you can have the very surface level question. And then you have the very deep level question. And it didn't feel necessarily right to ask really, really deep question, like super deep on the first date, either necessarily, because well, maybe second, or third, but not a first day. So what's between the surface and what's between like, and the bottom of the sea here? Like we're really going super deep. And we took topics and said, What's that middle level question that does help the person reveal something about themselves, but doesn't force them to be so vulnerable? And they can have some fun with it. And you know, so we actually practice practice and played with constructing questions that would fall between those two that would be totally appropriate on a first date, but not feel like I would bring forth meaningful connection and insight on the person without feeling like oh, my god, they're so deep that you could turn somebody off in the first second.

Amy Steindler  
Oh, I want to see that list. I think we need that list. You know, it's somewhere between where'd you go to school? And you know, your most embarrassing moment? I don't know. Maybe meris most embarrassing moment is okay for a first date. But yeah, I want to know, I don't know what Sunday You know, well, I

Adina Tovell  
think even just to kind of give a glimpse, like when you said, you know, where did you go to school or something like that? Okay, we use try, we talked about staying away from questions where there might be a one word answer, oh, here's the name of the university, which doesn't really give you anything about the person, you know, but asking about, you know, what's the most, you know, interesting Professor you've encountered in school so far right? is going to it's not a one word answer. You know, it's something that's going to reveal like, does this person have a sense of humor? How serious are they about their schoolwork? What topics? are they finding interesting, like something is going to come out of that? Other than just asking like, where do you go to school, but you know, who's the most interesting Professor you had so far? And, you know, what's something that they've done that really struck you like? Okay, that's a reasonable question, I think.

Amy Steindler  
And I love that you're talking about what interests them? Right? So you can ask that question in so many different contexts. You know, what's the most interesting thing you're working on? But the most interesting thing you've seen on the news lately, just Just what are you interested in? Because that's what we want to talk about, right? We want to talk about what we're interested in, not what we don't care about. So I love that sort of line that you're going down there? Or do you know, you know, what's most interesting about that?

Adina Tovell  
And that's a little bit of a preview. Because when we do have well wise on the podcast, and third week in September, actually, we're gonna play some games with questions like challenge each other to come up with questions like on the fly on the spot, we're gonna have a little bit of fun. So you want to come back for that one, because it's gonna be we're gonna have a good time. But today, Amy, I thought we would take the live deck of the live with the courage to be curious, I've been talking about these card decks for a long time. I've been writing about them. And I haven't really I've never done this before on the podcast, where we just pull cards and say, what does it sound like? to respond to one of these questions? What does it sound like to encounter them? And my hope was in creating them is that one, it would provide people with examples of some questions. Some people have told me that they placed them on the table at dinner, and suddenly they're teenagers and young adult children who would never ever, ever share and be as revealing, like if they are parent, ask them a question, suddenly will in response to a card because there's no presumption of judgment or expectation when the card asks the question, as opposed to posed to the parents, right? So people who've like done that, put them out on a coffee table or dinner table. And then, you know, other times where people have used them for journal writing, and but what can you actually do with them? And how can you use them to just kind of reveal what's going on inside and get more connected to yourself? So that's what we're gonna do today, Amy?

Amy Steindler  
I love that. And I just want to highlight what you said, it's so interesting to me. And I wonder if you have more to say about it. The idea that it's the card asking the question, not the other person, why is that so compelling?

Adina Tovell  
I think when we're in relationship with people, there's so much history and background that when somebody asks question, our mind goes to like, Well, why are they asking that? Do they think something about that, you know, they, they're, they try to figure out what the angle is. And so they don't, I think, feel as free. I mean, I know that, like, if somebody asked me a question my first time, I'd be like, okay, what's the reason? They're asking you that? Either? Are they asking? So can I, I want to know, so I can give them an answer that really answers what they want to know, or is there some backstory here that I might think is at play here, and this is some kind of insidious thing going on? And I think we do that when a person because we have a whole backstory of a relationship that comes into play when the question gets asked.

Amy Steindler  
I think that's true. I think that's true. And I'm wondering, you know, how do we since we're up in our heads, like, thinking about what the other person's motivation might be? What is the what is the best way to kind of get past that or get through that? You know, is that a question back saying, Oh, interesting question. What made you ask that one? And sometimes I'll sometimes I'll answer the question and then ask, that was an interesting question. What made you ask that one? Just to satisfy my own either curiosity or calm my neurosis or anything like that? I'm curious. I mean, how do you how do you process that for yourself? How do you? How do you get past that moment?

Adina Tovell  
Well, sometimes I do if I think that they're asking a question, and they could mean multiple things by it, then I will say tell me you know why you're asking that question. Mostly because I want to, you know, know that I'm answering in the right direction because I am so I'm, I'm always blown away and fascinated that when I ask a question like that, how many different responses I could get, like, I mean, what's in my head is definitely not what's in the other person's head. And I'm always blown away like, Oh, that makes sense. That wasn't what I was thinking. But like, awesome, let me answer that question, man. Right. And so sometimes I ask it so that I know that I'm kind of answering the question that they actually intended to ask. Because words can mean so many different things. And then sometimes if I'm maybe nervous, or a little on edge, that there's some sort of motive there, then I feel like it's better to have the motive out on the table, other than myself, otherwise, I feel like I'm sort of walking into a trap or wondering if I'm walking into a trap, which might make me more guarded and how I answer and that way that would interfere with the connection.

Amy Steindler  
No, that's so interesting that you know, and I want to keep this on the table to this idea of assuming positive intent, and how when we're in relationships, and we'll talk about this more in the love section, I think, how we're in relationships with people that we know, care about us. And yet we still don't assume positive intent, we still wonder, you know, is this a trap? Is there something going to happen to me here? So, I just want to flag that for everybody? Yes, well,

Adina Tovell  
we're definitely going to get more deeply into that in the Love Episode here. So but what I wanted to do, Amy, as I said, is that will pick cards, we're gonna pick cards for each other. And I wanted to give people the opportunity to witness right, whether auditorily because you're on podcast, or visually and auditorily, if you're watching this on YouTube here, what our experiences are, and they're not right or wrong, but they're just another I always think of that like Wizard of Oz thing, like when you get to pull back the curtain and, you know, a question all the time, we're like, what does that mean to her? Like, how does she actually do it? Or how does Amy do it? So I love this idea. They're gonna like pull back the curtain and actually share that. All right, roll it. All right, well, I'm going to let you pick one, first, I will take the vulnerable seat first, you get to pick

Amy Steindler  
what it is. Alright, I have my lift deck in front of me. And I am just going to take the one that's on top, which says, you're going to hate me. What keeps appearing right in front of me, that I refuse to see. Start with the easy one.

Adina Tovell  
So what keeps appearing right in front of me that I refuse to see here is really amazing. I have been looking at this one thing, like probably for a good 10 to 12 years. And it's like right there. And I do even look at it. But I just somehow or another don't seem to fully connect with it. Like I'm just starting to say okay, I'm not only going to see you, but I'm going to actually acknowledge you and maybe want to connect with your presence. So you know, what that is for me is it is actually something in the business of courage to be curious. And because I we are insatiably curious. And there's so many things that I find fascinating, is it one of the things that I've both had fun with, but also struggled with is the number of different directions that courage to be curious has gone in, and that it can go in. And there's this thing that has been standing right in front of me. In fact, if I'm coaching other clients, I'll even say to them, the narrower that you go, the more kind of focused you become, the more you can niche. And I have this one coach who graduated from my coaching program, who became a thyroid coach, talk about being specific, she became a thyroid coach, he only deals with people with thyroid issues, one of the most successful coaches graduates of our program, because she went so narrow, and if I were guiding anybody else, that's what I would tell them to do. And this thing has been like sitting right there. It's almost like just sitting there on the corner. Like, right, I'm still here. Yep, I'm not going away. Because like, you know, there's still something really important going on here. And, you know, not being able to rein in, I think initially, there were some pieces that Well, how do I know which is the right thing, and I got caught in the trap that I think lots of people and our kind of industry is like, which is the right thing to do. Then I got that out of the way. And I was like, but there's so many interesting things and I liked doing them all. And so I would diversify and all of these directions doing a lot of interesting things but not really growing the business and I always had this tension and pulled between being excited and fascinated, but also a little unhappy and dissatisfied with the fact that I wasn't really building in the way I wanted to be building and that little you know what you just pointed out that thing that's right in front of me has been sitting there on the corner just saying you know what it is and I'm just gonna sit here I mean so patient like I like to say thank you for being so incredibly patient leave like stuck with me for like 12 years or something, you know, like, just still sitting there and waiting For me to actually acknowledge your presence. And I would say it's not until this year as people have been experiencing the relaunch where I have been willing had the courage, maybe a shift in some fundamental beliefs to say, I get you now, like, I'm not bringing you into my team now. And I'm going to let you be my guide, rather than just sitting on the side.

Amy Steindler  
Yeah, you know, what's coming up for me, that's interesting on that is, you know, you've been able to guide your clients through that, you know, and then for all of us, as coaches and for all of us as humans, you know, if we think about the piece of advice that we're most likely to give someone else. It's usually the one that we most need to hear, right? So I've been told, you know, we teach that which we most need to learn. So I think when you're answering that question, what keeps appearing in front of me that I refuse to see, if you pull that out of your deck, then you're you're having trouble answering it, it's a pretty quick route to just say are what what am I telling everyone else?

Adina Tovell  
So literally, you're so spot on there, right? If we just listen to ourselves, we would know exactly what it was. And, you know, we I think as coaches, we know that the things that come up in our coaching sessions are very much like projections of things that we like, need to hear or experiencing, too. And sometimes I've actually finished a coaching session and being like, I should be paying that person, because they brought up the very thing that I need to be looking at right now and seeing, and they gave me an opportunity to explore it at the same time that they were exploring it. And so absolutely, that's true. And I think also, the seeing the thing that's right in front of us, that we're not paying attention to. I do you know, and I want to put out there because there's always, sometimes it's you, we're not saying it, because it's not the right time, you know, and that's legitimate, like, it's not the right time to be seeing and truly engaging, like we can know, it's there and everything, and it's right time. And then the other part is the honesty about what's the fear there. You know, what's the fear? And for me, it's interesting, there were a few different fears that I think came up around this one is

I'm always afraid of being bored.

Like, I'm being afraid that if I go narrow, or really focus on something that eventually I'll get bored. And that's something that I've had to interrogate, like, Where did that come from? How true is that? And why does that keep coming up for me? Right? Because when you're curious, you're never really bored. So why does that, like, hit me there? And if I'm gonna be totally honest, which I want to because I want people to be honest with themselves. Like, that's a really interesting response, and not a really helpful one, I think, but one that is true. So I'm, you know, if I want to be courageous, it's like, where does that come from? What's behind that?

Amy Steindler  
Yes, you know, that the idea that, you know, you're going to pick this direction, and you will now be chained to that for the rest of your natural life, you know, there's going to be some sort of process some sort of evolution for you some sort of deepening of it, some tweak here or there, that will keep it fresh for you is my, my assumption. But I think it's interesting that the thing that we're afraid of a lot of times is that we're we're going to be stuck with it forever, and it's gonna feel bad.

Adina Tovell  
Yeah, there are those of us who are afraid to be stuck with something forever, and those who want to have the same thing for everyone afraid to have anything changed.

Amy Steindler  
I love that. That is the other side of that coin. Right? Let me let me just dig into this thing. So you can be comfortable forever.

Adina Tovell  
Right? And neither one are helpful. And you know, Amy, I would say but you're so intuitive and you're spot on and then I'm gonna pick a question for you. But this whole notion of putting roots in and feeling like something is fixed, you know, and it's not fixed forever, I could change anything. I wanted another five years and intellectually I know that. But that has been something that I've struggled with of, you know, rooting something down in place because of this lurking sensation of Will I be stuck there and will I not have jump be able have the opportunity to jump into other things so that might seem exciting or adventurous and like to FOMO maybe it's FOMO like fear of missing out? Like if I go here, where am I not going right? Ah, that actually just sort of came up from this right. Is there a bit of FOMO there?

Amy Steindler  
Yeah, I think that that resonates for me in terms of what I hear a lot from other people if I make this choice, what choices Am I not making it? Oh, my God, you know, so then there's this idea of, you know, how do I trust my instincts, my intuition, and the fact that I am not stuck here forever that this if this doesn't work, you know, those standards may or may not still be out there, but something else something better will. And you know, we have to look at our own life experience that way. Right. You know, we're, we're so afraid we're going to get stuck. And you know, we've never been able to hold on to anything forever.

Adina Tovell  
That was good examination. I like that. I just one little question. One little question we could go on for a long time. All right, let me pick one for you, Amy. I've got my cards here. Okay, actually, this one's nice. Who do I appreciate in my life? And

Amy Steindler  
what do I appreciate about them? Oh, my gosh, the list is long distinguished. Um, well, you know, I have to start at home with my husband, who is who sees me? Who knows me? You know, I'm so grateful for that. What was the question again? What who do I appreciate in my life? So it is gratitude? What do I appreciate? Yeah, I appreciate his willingness to go deep. I appreciate that. He reads two or three newspapers every day that is smart and well informed. I appreciate the coffee that is on the coffee table. Every No, no, that's my table when I wake up in the morning. I appreciate that. He pushes me to be better that he recognizes what I'm good at and wants me to do more of it. Yeah, I appreciate that. He's on my side, like, totally, completely, utterly on my side, which is brilliant. I mean, I whatever might be wrong with our relationship. That's what's right with it. You know, he just is totally on my side. Does his own work? I appreciate that. Right. doesn't ask me to do his growth work for him. Gosh, I could go on and on. So, Dave,

Adina Tovell  
so let me Can I just pause you there for a second and answer your question. Sure. Sure. What did it feel like to you to talk about him in that way?

Amy Steindler  
I feel almost like guilty, like, how did I get so lucky? And is it? Is it okay for me to have that? Right? Do I deserve it? You know, I start to question that a little bit. But it's just, it's my life in a way I can't believe how lucky I am that this is my life. You know, there's there are I mean, it's not perfect. Of course, it's not. But I always say that it's perfect tenants and perfection. There's nothing that I I'm content, you know, people get a little wrapped around the art form contentment, thinking it means I don't want things to change. I don't want anything you know, to get better. And that's not true. It's just that in this moment, when I look at the the journey, when I look at where we started and where we are now and how we've handled that together as a team. It feels amazing. It's just I'm making the giddy face for those who can't see it. It's pretty special. It's pretty extraordinary. And I I I know that not everybody has that.

Adina Tovell  
So if I want to just ask you. So if you kind of go inside your body, like maybe even close your eyes for a second you think about literally what does it physically feel to talk about this appreciation that you have for him? Like, what does that feel like? As opposed to when we might have been talking about you know, just kind of other things about questions? What does it feel like to talk about him?

Amy Steindler  
There's a lightness about it. There's like a tingling lightness about it. You know, it's just part of me again, wants to stand on the rooftop and be like, Oh my god, I have this thing. You know, I have this person in my life that is just so there for me. So I would just Yeah, I'd say there's a light if I'm a little bit taller, I don't know. It's showing up on the video, but I'm a little bit taller. I feel full. My cup runneth over. You know, I feel very full and it it and I remember thinking this. On the day I got married, I just remember thinking how easy it is to be generous. When I have that feeling of being full right of being seen or being heard, I don't need or want anything. So it's easy for me to give that to others.

Adina Tovell  
And I want to just make this comment because I you know, somebody who's listening or watching this and thinking about the difference between the two questions like one of them seem to sort of like penetrate into your, you know, into my space of like, okay, make you be a little bit more kind of critical of yourself and what's going on? And let's sort of examine and this one, you know, what do I appreciate? There's a lightness to that question, right? The questions have different kinds of energy to them. I think. And you're like you're having a moment right now.

Amy Steindler  
I'm having a moment. I mean, I'm looking at the question, and I know how important language is when we're asking these questions. And, you know, what keeps appearing right in front of me that I refuse to see, right? There's like, I'm refusing therefore, there's maybe some judgment behind that.

Adina Tovell  
Yeah, I don't, you know, there could be judgment, or it could just be sort of it almost says to look deeply at this. And, you know, engage a beat permit yourself to look critically at it. I mean, I think the question sort of, you know, says too, this is a place for you to kind of really examine something, or that was the intention behind it. Right. If we talk about intention, you know, and then there are questions in this deck, what do I appreciate, for the very reason that you just said so beautifully, because in answering them, we might fill our bucket up? You know, like, you just said, I feel like I'm running over. I'm doing, you know, all of this. And, you know, in the question that I answered, I was more like, Hmm, this is interesting. I'm learning about myself. I'm seeing something I didn't see before. And that's one kind of, you know, that's facilitating this growth. And then the other part is asking yours is like a question. And some of these it's like, sometimes it's to ask a question, because it fills somebody up, and it's just so beautiful.

Amy Steindler  
Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. And I think the language is important. I'm I'm I'm maybe getting a little wrapped around the axle on the the word refusal, but I refuse to see. And maybe it's resist, because you don't, you're not refusing. I mean, I put it in front of you, and you answered, you look down.

Adina Tovell  
I think the reason I chose refuse and writing that, because I love that you're bringing up language because it's so good. I think the reason I chose refuse is I specifically chose, like an even more words have, like vibrations to them, right? And resist has just a slightly softer vibration than refused, right? And so absolutely, the word refuse sort of like compels you, I wanted it to tell you to look at something instead of just sort of like, Okay, well, we could look at that, but I wanted you to feel compelled and the word refuse, seem to me could and it's going to be different from for different people, but for me, seem to be like have this compelling nature to it.

Amy Steindler  
I think it does. And I think what's coming up for me is this is my own neurosis like my own, like fear of, Oh, my God, why did I pick a question that has a word like refuse? Why did I pick the question that has the hard resonance? You know, instead of the something a little bit later, you know, what's, what's up with me that I wanted to put something in front of Edina that she's been refusing to see. And I think, you know, this, this absolutely has to do with my own experience as a as a as a beginning coach, you know, really wanting to, you know, hit it hard. And I don't, you know, I don't see myself doing that as much anymore. I'm still targeted, I think, but for me, I'm like, oh, gosh, was I Was I being a jerk? Why are you refusing to see it Dina?

Adina Tovell  
Well, and Isn't that like, you just did that? Again, if you're watching, you would have seen Amy's like face that really match that tone of voice. If I say you know, what's right in front of you that you're refusing to see, right? I can put a sense of judgment in my voice. I can have a facial expression that expresses judgment and sort of like I'm pointing the finger at you like this thing is obvious out here. You're refusing to see it get on board, right? So I could convey that with my tone. And with my voice. The way you asked it, however, engaged my curiosity, and it made me totally think, hmm, you know, and I went totally into reflective, introspective space. I think it's important what you're raising, because if you do pick a card, or somebody asks you a question, and you have a really strong reaction to it, that's a good thing to get curious about to why am I having such a strong reaction to that? And then I love the game of Okay, if that question is hitting me in a way that makes it almost except inaccessible to answer what words could I shift around or substitute, they then give me access? Absolutely beautiful. And let's not be afraid to play with our questions because they're not like hard and fast and fixed. And there's no like biblical authority to the way that they're written. If playing with a word or phrase or something like that creates more accessibility and something then let's do that for ourselves. If you were to open up my journal, and I, you know, sort of threaten that I'm going to start taking pictures In my journal so people can see this. But, you know, you will sometimes see me like writing multiple versions of the question until I find that resonant. Let's come back to that word resonant one, because sometimes I'm like reading the phrasing, and I'm like, oh, that doesn't really seem to get it quite right or that line, which doesn't feel exactly right, that feels more judgmental than I want to be that feels like it takes my head in a different direction. That one actually feels like I'm avoiding the issue that way. And so I'll keep playing with the structure of a question until I get that experience of resonance that we talked about in the very beginning that says, When I read that, I can absolutely know that is the right question.

Amy Steindler  
Yeah, that's great. Yeah. And I think anyone who is, you know, thinking about doing this, you know, picking on a question partner, which I highly recommend, you know, pick someone to work through some of these questions with or play through some of these questions will, and talk about the questions themselves and how they feel, and you know, what they trigger.

Adina Tovell  
I love that. And so I will, you know, you brought it up. So I'm just gonna say I'm planting seeds. I'm going to be planting seeds for about five months here. I think I'm planting seeds for a program that we're going to be launching in 2022, which is Question of the week, which are live events aiming to do just that, where we are going to be offering questions, guidance for thinking in a community to think about it with thought, you know, question partners explore a growth partners to do that with. And this is actually going to become a global wide program that we are going to launch for people who are curious seekers, like I would call you and I here so I'm just dropping planting some seeds right here. We'll see more about this, because January 2022, is going to be a huge launch for that. There you have it. Okay. I'm gonna get straight man. So Amy, we this was about actually asking each other questions, which I love. And I think in this episode, you know, maybe less each of us say, what are we hoping people are going to most take from having listened to this episode? So, you know, Amy, what, in your kind of deepest heart of hearts Do you wish for people as they're coming away from this episode?

Amy Steindler  
I wish for them to and this is gonna sound kind of trite. But I wish for them to develop that courage to end that curiosity to one, though, and to wanted to ask more questions, and to be little scientists, little social scientists and go out there and experiment. I want for them to feel free to try things and free to fail with them and free to see what happens.

Adina Tovell  
That's what you know, beautiful. And that playfulness, like let's go play. Right? And I think I would want to say I would like people to see curiosity and asking questions as the ultimate alternative to judgment. So that again, please. I would like for people to experience questions and curiosity as the ultimate alternative to judgment.

Amy Steindler  
Well, and that's exactly what it's done for me. Right. So in past episodes, I've talked about, you know, very judgmental upbringing, you know, where I did that all the time. And this is what's been saving me. So, yes. to that. a hearty? Yes. So two judgments are

Adina Tovell  
there were harsh on ourselves, or we find, and, you know, I'll just show this a little bit of story. So I'm Jewish. And every year on the holiday of Yom Kippur, we're supposed to atone for our sins. And I remember like my entire life, like from the time I sort of became conscious of things like this, probably in my teens, all the way into my mid 40s. Before I started discovering curiosity, there's this thing like for the sin I have committed, and then you name bazillions of sins, ones that you've done, and ones that would just have been part of a more global community. But the ones that always struck me, the resonant ones were always the sins of judgment and sins of using Word and words and speech in ways that were hurtful, you know, whether that was for myself or others, and it stems I think, from an insecurity inside me. And so I was kind of like guard shielding my insecurity by judging others on the outside. And I was really frustrated with the fact that every single year I would come home and I would beat on my chest for like the same things, but it didn't seem to beat me out of it, beat it out of me, right. I was still every single year, committing the same Sins of speech to others. And then also in the ways I was talking to myself, which for many of us as much harsher than we would ever talk to another human being. And it was in embracing curiosity and the asking of questions. That was the one that was the move, the winning move, that turned me away from that, and not that I know ever say something that I wish I could reframe in a different way or that wasn't hurtful. But it's not a regular practice of how I live, I don't speak harshly to myself anymore. And I don't carry any judgment because I carry curiosity, and curiosity and judgment can't live in the same place together. That's gorgeous. So I would want people walking away saying, If I don't like either how judgmental I am of myself or of others, to say, let

me try this. Let me try curiosity

as an alternative. And this is what we do every single week on a pirate podcast and in our blog, is we get curious, so come along for that ride.

Amy Steindler  
And you know, if we think about what's happening in the world, and political situations and tension and strife, and what if everyone stopped just deciding who they liked and who they didn't? And why they thought they were that way? And just got curious, what would happen to the world if we approached everything with curiosity, as opposed to, here's what you're doing? And I know you're doing?

Adina Tovell  
Absolutely. Well, Amy, it's been amazing. And just to again, preview, this is our live episode, the beginning of September, we are going to be embracing the power of questions and love and relationships. Next week, and then in Oh, sorry, no leadership, we will be looking at it in leadership. And then we will come back to love in the third week, and then we will have our grand finale episode and Amy's favorite part of being on the podcast, which is asking those surprise questions. So in our finale episode, we are always surprising each other with questions and seeing what happens. And so we will do that along with our guest, Chad Littlefield who will be with us for that grand finale. And if you want to travel this journey with us about asking powerful questions, we encourage you to get the book listen on at audible you actually have well from the time of listening, probably we should get partly into it, or go on to their web page. We in me is the name of their company. And you can experience a little bit well wise and Chad little fields and the work that they do around asking powerful questions. And if you actually do that, and you end up with a burning question you want me to make sure to ask them, then go ahead and send an email to info at courage to be curious, calm. I would love Love, love to have people sending in a question, say could you ask whether to add this question? So that would be awesome. And we will be back again with you next week with courage to be curious. The Gina taraval. Amy will be with us again. We will see you soon. Amy, thank you for being here. Thanks for having me. It's a delight.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai